[CLBS] Indigent lien

[Paul Ross]

Typical protocol is that as soon as the application is received, the county
records the lien.  IC 31-3504  If you file before the lien is recorded,
then you will have trumped and the statutory (sneaky) lien will not
attach.  If the assistance is not awarded, then the lien will be released.

A determination can be made on the assistance without the participation of
the indigent.  My experience is that contempt is not pursued if an
individual does not show up.  However, the commissioners can still move
forward based on the application and award or deny.  No signature is
required of the indigent, as mentioned, a hospital or other entity can file
the application.

Be aware this sneaky lien is more than real property.  It attaches against
all real and personal property in the state.  This includes insurance
benefits and can come back in probate cases like a Medicaid lien.  A stop
title can be issued through ITD.  The N-1 is recorded with the Secretary of
State.

On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 11:17 AM, James Macdonald <jmacdonald at ejame.com>
wrote:

> Ryan-the problem is the hospital or medical provider can fill out the
> application on behalf of the patient.
>
> Regards,
>
> James S. Macdonald
>
> Elsaesser Jarzabek Anderson Elliott & Macdonald, Chtd.
> PO Box 1049
> Lake Plaza Building - 123 South Third Avenue, Suite 24
> Sandpoint, ID  83864
> 208.263.8517
> 208.263.0759 (Fax)
>
> The information in this email message may be privileged, confidential and
> protected from disclosure.  If you are not the intended recipient, any
> dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly prohibited.  If you
> think you received this email message in error, please reply to
> james at ejame.com<mailto:ford at ejame.com> or call (208) 263-8517.
>
> From: refasu at gmail.com [mailto:refasu at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Ryan
> Farnsworth
> Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2014 10:14 AM
> To: James Macdonald; Bankruptcy list
> Subject: Re: [CLBS] Indigent lien
>
> I've talked to Bart Davis and Fred Wood (Chair of the Health & Welfare
> Committee in the House, and probably the best informed legislator on
> matters of county indigency and medicaid).  Both say that further expansion
> of Obamacare/medicaid would get rid of the county indigency system, but the
> political will isn't there, so it won't be happening very soon.
> Until then, tell everyone you know not to ever sign an application for aid
> from county indigency.
>
> Ryan Farnsworth
> Avery Law
> Idaho Falls, ID
>
> On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 9:50 AM, James Macdonald <jmacdonald at ejame.com
> <mailto:jmacdonald at ejame.com>> wrote:
> This is off the top of my head with no research done.
>
> 1.   I don't think so.  The lien dates back to the time the services are
> rendered.
> 2.  Yes, failure to appear could result in contempt.  I think your client
> will be subpoenaed to appear and produce documents about their income and
> assets.
>
> I assume your client has real property, otherwise there would be no
> concern about this bogus lien.  It is my understanding Idaho is the only
> state that has the indigence lien.   It has the draconian effect of not
> allowing an Idaho citizen who happens to own real property to effectively
> use BK to get rid of medical debts.  It elevates hospitals and medical
> providers over all other unsecureds.  This really needs to be looked at by
> our legislature.
>
> Bart Davis are you reading this?
>
> Regards,
> James S. Macdonald
>
> Elsaesser Jarzabek Anderson Elliott & Macdonald, Chtd.
> PO Box 1049
> Lake Plaza Building - 123 South Third Avenue, Suite 24
> Sandpoint, ID  83864
> 208.263.8517<tel:208.263.8517>
> 208.263.0759<tel:208.263.0759> (Fax)
>
> The information in this email message may be privileged, confidential and
> protected from disclosure.  If you are not the intended recipient, any
> dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly prohibited.  If you
> think you received this email message in error, please reply to
> james at ejame.com<mailto:james at ejame.com> or call (208) 263-8517
> <tel:%28208%29%20263-8517>.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: CLBS [mailto:clbs-bounces at admws.idaho.gov<mailto:
> clbs-bounces at admws.idaho.gov>] On Behalf Of Patrick J. Geile
> Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2014 8:35 AM
> To: 'CLBS at admws.idaho.gov<mailto:CLBS at admws.idaho.gov>'
> Subject: [CLBS] Indigent lien
>
> Client cuts his arm off and hospital reattaches, Client has no insurance
> so there is a 170K bill.  The hospital applies for county assistance
> through the indigency program. The application was initially denied and the
> hospital has appealed.
>
> I have the following questions
>
>
> 1)      If client files bankruptcy, will that stop the process
> permanently, thus preventing the lien?
>
> 2)      If client decides to not participate in the hearing, is there a
> penalty, ie a bench warrant, contempt?
>
>
>
>
>
> Patrick J. Geile
> Foley Freeman PLLC
> 953 S. Industry Way, Meridian, Idaho 83642 P.O. Box 10 Meridian, Idaho
> 83642 Direct line: (208) 947-1563<tel:%28208%29%20947-1563>
> Phone:  (208) 888-9111<tel:%28208%29%20888-9111>
> Fax:  (208) 888-5130<tel:%28208%29%20888-5130>
>
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